Braumeister - 20L

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Braumeister - 20L

Postby usmcruz » Fri Jun 10, 2011 4:27 pm

What do you guys think? I mean, it looks like a cool system, but you cant sparge, so you gotta do concentrated brews, and you cant brew beers over 1.057 sg. All that with a $2,000.00 price tag? :? Im really trying wrap my head around it, and by no means bashing what looks like a solid system for low gravity beers, but why so much? Looks like something like this would be easy to build. Any thoughts?
In the bottle
Gianna's Fire in the hole Imperial IPA
HVAC (Hazelnut Vanilla and Chocolate)Porter
Rye Style Vienna
Oktoasterfest
English Special bitter
Stout
Blonde
Bohemian Pilsner
Nut brown Porter
Porkchop Express Amber
Pale Ale
Bourbon Porter
Hefe
In the fermenter
Pilsner
Barley Wine
Bock
Old Ale
Al Capones Speak Easy
Ordinary Bitter
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Re: Braumeister - 20L

Postby thetooth » Fri Jun 10, 2011 4:32 pm

The first thing I did when I saw it was check the calendar to see if it was April Fools Day again. LOL

That having been done, I'm still not sure what to make of it. It seems plausible, but the price seems a bit crazy... and it still lacks a good way to chill down the wort, which I was sort of expecting at that price in a do-it-all sort of system.
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Re: Braumeister - 20L

Postby usmcruz » Fri Jun 10, 2011 4:46 pm

thetooth wrote:The first thing I did when I saw it was check the calendar to see if it was April Fools Day again. LOL

That having been done, I'm still not sure what to make of it. It seems plausible, but the price seems a bit crazy... and it still lacks a good way to chill down the wort, which I was sort of expecting at that price in a do-it-all sort of system.




I mean, you have a solid pot, with two couplers welded on the bottom plus the heating element coupler, center post, and another pot, I mean basket that slides over the post, which is either preforatated on the bottom, or has a hole in the bottom to allow the wort to flow up. False bottom on top to keep the grains in place, a temp controller which you can get for $50 to $100, round heating element, and a march pump.
In the bottle
Gianna's Fire in the hole Imperial IPA
HVAC (Hazelnut Vanilla and Chocolate)Porter
Rye Style Vienna
Oktoasterfest
English Special bitter
Stout
Blonde
Bohemian Pilsner
Nut brown Porter
Porkchop Express Amber
Pale Ale
Bourbon Porter
Hefe
In the fermenter
Pilsner
Barley Wine
Bock
Old Ale
Al Capones Speak Easy
Ordinary Bitter
"If you want peace, be prepared for war"
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Re: Braumeister - 20L

Postby thetooth » Fri Jun 10, 2011 5:07 pm

Yeah... I understand what you mean. It doesn't look like it should cost anywhere near what it does.
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Re: Braumeister - 20L

Postby gustavf » Sat Jun 11, 2011 8:31 am

I have used this system for some 25 brews the last year and it is very popular here in Norway. Having 240 volt electricity and little tradition for using gas, it is certainly a bit more versatile here than in the US, but I have to say I love my Braumeister. Certainly not a system for barley wines, but up to 1065 it works pretty well. Normal efficiency is around 75-80%.

You can, and should, sparge. After lifting the malt pipe, add water from the top. This is not the gentle, slow sparge you normally want, but it works pretty well.

The system is compact, very compact, and I normally brew in my shower stall. It takes less than 10 minutes to get it out from the cabinet and set it up and cleanup is also fairly easy.
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Re: Braumeister - 20L

Postby tookalisten » Sat Jun 11, 2011 1:47 pm

I'm glad to see it offered as I like options and find it interesting; but not for me at that price, I had rather put that money in a sculpture. However, if you had space limitations, it would be great.
Enjoy the little things, for one day you may look back and realize they were the big things.
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Kegged: Denny's Old Stoner, RIS, Oatmeal Stout, Pliny IPA, Vienna Lager, Amber, IPA
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Re: Braumeister - 20L

Postby usmcruz » Sat Jun 11, 2011 5:24 pm

gustavf wrote:I have used this system for some 25 brews the last year and it is very popular here in Norway. Having 240 volt electricity and little tradition for using gas, it is certainly a bit more versatile here than in the US, but I have to say I love my Braumeister. Certainly not a system for barley wines, but up to 1065 it works pretty well. Normal efficiency is around 75-80%.

You can, and should, sparge. After lifting the malt pipe, add water from the top. This is not the gentle, slow sparge you normally want, but it works pretty well.

The system is compact, very compact, and I normally brew in my shower stall. It takes less than 10 minutes to get it out from the cabinet and set it up and cleanup is also fairly easy.




Im kinda curious, how are you getting 1.065 wort when the system limitations are 1.057? you adding dme? Another thing I find hard to believe that your getting 75 to 80% sparging, because in order to reach the 75 to 80% range your sparge would exceed the starting volume capacities of the system. Am I missing something?
In the bottle
Gianna's Fire in the hole Imperial IPA
HVAC (Hazelnut Vanilla and Chocolate)Porter
Rye Style Vienna
Oktoasterfest
English Special bitter
Stout
Blonde
Bohemian Pilsner
Nut brown Porter
Porkchop Express Amber
Pale Ale
Bourbon Porter
Hefe
In the fermenter
Pilsner
Barley Wine
Bock
Old Ale
Al Capones Speak Easy
Ordinary Bitter
"If you want peace, be prepared for war"
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Re: Braumeister - 20L

Postby gustavf » Sun Jun 12, 2011 4:26 am

usmcruz wrote:Im kinda curious, how are you getting 1.065 wort when the system limitations are 1.057? you adding dme?


I was surprised to see MoreBeer quote a 1.057 system limit, as there is certainly no problem brewing stronger beer on the system (without DME or a very long boil time). You might have problems with stronger brews than 1.057 if you follow the user guide, which by the way is a horrible translation from German, and do not sparge.

Another thing I find hard to believe that your getting 75 to 80% sparging, because in order to reach the 75 to 80% range your sparge would exceed the starting volume capacities of the system. Am I missing something?


You mash with 22-23 liters of water, which is what you need to cover the heating elements when the wort is pumped through the malt pipe. When you lift the malt pipe, there is room for 27 liters underneath the pipe and you can sparge with almost 10 liters of water. The kettle is just under 40 liters, I believe.

If you use the 50 liter version, these numbers are different and if you use the 50 liter version with the short malt pipe you can sparge with "unlimited" amounts of water.

The milling is also important when using this system. I have had the best efficiency when I almost have a stuck mash and the sparging is slightly slower, but too fine milling and the pump will start to build pressure under the malt and the wort will make a channel resulting in a volcano effect. If that happens, you'd better keep the lid on and reach for the pause button.
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Re: Braumeister - 20L

Postby usmcruz » Sun Jun 12, 2011 11:19 pm

Ok, that makes more sense to me now, thanks for clarifying that.
In the bottle
Gianna's Fire in the hole Imperial IPA
HVAC (Hazelnut Vanilla and Chocolate)Porter
Rye Style Vienna
Oktoasterfest
English Special bitter
Stout
Blonde
Bohemian Pilsner
Nut brown Porter
Porkchop Express Amber
Pale Ale
Bourbon Porter
Hefe
In the fermenter
Pilsner
Barley Wine
Bock
Old Ale
Al Capones Speak Easy
Ordinary Bitter
"If you want peace, be prepared for war"
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Re: Braumeister - 20L

Postby krizwit » Mon Jun 13, 2011 9:54 am

The system looks interesting, but I agree with the rest that it is quite a bit for what you get. It should come with a chiller....That being said, if you lived in a small apartment and had 240V access, along with a good chunk of disposable income it would be a fine purchase.

After reading a recent article on CNN I found the cost of living in Norway to be extremely high. They pay like 4 times as much for beer as we do so brewing on anything would pay off in probably a year or two..... gustavf could probably elaborate on that.
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Re: Braumeister - 20L

Postby gustavf » Mon Jun 13, 2011 2:14 pm

krizwit wrote:The system looks interesting, but I agree with the rest that it is quite a bit for what you get. It should come with a chiller....That being said, if you lived in a small apartment and had 240V access, along with a good chunk of disposable income it would be a fine purchase.


It is certainly not a cheap system and not for everyone, but if you compare the price with a brew sculpture or a similiar system it is at least comparable. There are advantages (very small footprint, easy to set up, mulit step mashing) and disadvantages (mainly limits on OG).

The Braumeister has become very popular here and I look forward to seeing how it does in the US. I have seen good reviews from US users on other forums, but the price and the need for 240 volts are not playing to it's advantage. We have more of a tradition for electrical brewing, 240V available everywhere, a long winter where you must brew inside and fewer houses with (potential brewing) garages.

I am very happy with the system, the build quality and the ease of use. Many are sold over here and most people seem to be very happy with theirs, but I will be careful to recommend it to others, especially in the US.

After reading a recent article on CNN I found the cost of living in Norway to be extremely high. They pay like 4 times as much for beer as we do so brewing on anything would pay off in probably a year or two..... gustavf could probably elaborate on that.


Yes, beer is rather expensive here, especially anything not a macro lager. Even so, I have never met anyone brewing to save money, at least not all grain. After all, we all know the cost of equipment and the other stuff we "need", but try to forget the cost of...

I know a number of people that have purchased the Braumeister and it was a bit of an investment for all of them, even if normal incomes are higher here. If they wanted to brew cheap beer, they would have chosen other and cheaper options, like a traditional cooler setup or never switched to all grain.

You get used to everything, however. These are prices for guest beers at my local brewpub (0,35 liters - 12 oz, prices converted to USD and rounded):
Hornbeer Happy Hoppy Viking $17, De Molen OpTop $14, Southern Tier Unearthly $18, Mikkeller Green Gold $16 and the list goes on. Low season airfare to the US $600... No wonder I try to make a drinking expedition every now and then.
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Re: Braumeister - 20L

Postby turbo_ale » Mon Jun 13, 2011 3:53 pm

gustavf wrote:Yes, beer is rather expensive here, especially anything not a macro lager. Even so, I have never met anyone brewing to save money, at least not all grain. After all, we all know the cost of equipment and the other stuff we "need", but try to forget the cost of...

I know a number of people that have purchased the Braumeister and it was a bit of an investment for all of them, even if normal incomes are higher here. If they wanted to brew cheap beer, they would have chosen other and cheaper options, like a traditional cooler setup or never switched to all grain.

You get used to everything, however. These are prices for guest beers at my local brewpub (0,35 liters - 12 oz, prices converted to USD and rounded):
Hornbeer Happy Hoppy Viking $17, De Molen OpTop $14, Southern Tier Unearthly $18, Mikkeller Green Gold $16 and the list goes on. Low season airfare to the US $600... No wonder I try to make a drinking expedition every now and then.


In America one can buy cheap beer like Bud Lite, 36 cans for 19.95, .55 cents each. Like you said most homebrewers do this as a hobby, to make a better beer than the cheap stuff, not so much about saving money, although one can to a certain point. Going all-grain reduces the costs, especially high gravity beers. You do not need a sculpture and the big bucks for all-grain, just some basic coolers / kegs will do.

My total costs per 12 oz high gravity, hoppy beer is .77 cents each. This does not include equipment or time, but does include everything else: grains, hops, dry yeast, oxy caps, yeast nutrient, propane, oxygen, star san, foam control.
This price can be further reduced by harvesting yeast, kegging.

I could not get used to those European prices, I would have to resort to pruno :shock:
http://articles.ocregister.com/2011-06- ... ison-pruno
ON TAP:
1. 2B
2. 4C
3. 15D
4. 21A
5. 1D
6. 4B
Bottled: Gewurztraminer, Pinot Noir, 17A, 15B, Smoked Morita Porter, PB Cocoa Porter, Cabernet Sauvignon, Bacon-Maple Porter, Jaggery Pale Ale
Fermenting: Cocoa Cherry Stout
Next: 18E, 16C

BEER, a mixture of malted grains, water, hops and yeast, that is transformed through the course of fermentation that transcends the simplicity of those basic ingredients, fundamentally into the drink of life.
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Re: Braumeister - 20L

Postby makomachine » Thu Jun 23, 2011 12:13 pm

I'm in the 'strongly interested' category - largely for time savings and indoor capabilities. My dilemma is 20L or 50L with the shorter malt pipe as an option. This would give me the option of 5 & 10 gallon batches in the same unit. Just not sure that flexibility is worth $1100 (unit price difference + additional malt pipe).
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Re: Braumeister - 20L

Postby makomachine » Fri Jun 24, 2011 3:28 pm

I'm the guinea pig - ordered today and will post back in late July on my experience with it.
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Re: Braumeister - 20L

Postby yambor44 » Sat Jun 25, 2011 10:37 am

makomachine wrote:I'm the guinea pig - ordered today and will post back in late July on my experience with it.



Good for you Jason!
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