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Pitch or not pitch Pliny Yeast Cake on American Barley Wine?

PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 10:07 am
by stusiegel
Last weekend I brewed a Pliny the Elder with a starting gravity of 1.068. This weekend I'm looking at doing an American Barley Wine. I was thinking of just throwing the American Barley Wine right on the yeast cake.

Since the yeast will be ready to rock and roll, I'd use my plate chiller and chill the wort to 64F since the yeast will produce a lot of heat.

Your thoughts or suggestions?

Re: Pitch or not pitch Pliny Yeast Cake on American Barley W

PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 12:29 pm
by pclemon
How did/are you dry-hopping the beer? I would not put the BW right on top of the yeast cake if that cake also included 6+ ounces of hops. If you're racking the pliny to a fresh carboy to dry hop it, yes, I would pitch the BW right onto the yeast cake. If your yeast cake includes all that hop material do a little research on yeast washing.

Re: Pitch or not pitch Pliny Yeast Cake on American Barley W

PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 3:42 pm
by rplace
I am all for pitching on existing yeast cakes for simplicity. Pete has a great point about what is in the previous fermentor...but my real concern would be is your 1.068 beer done in a week?

Re: Pitch or not pitch Pliny Yeast Cake on American Barley W

PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 4:09 pm
by Mike_
yes.. if dry hopped in a secondary you would be OK to do it!

Re: Pitch or not pitch Pliny Yeast Cake on American Barley W

PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 4:10 pm
by CA_Mouse
I agree with pitching on a clean yeast cake. But that beer finishing in a week, might be overly ambitious. I always leave mine for 2 weeks no matter what before testing them for final gravity. If I'm going to repitch, I will always rack off first and dry hop in the keg.

Re: Pitch or not pitch Pliny Yeast Cake on American Barley W

PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2014 8:09 am
by Brewtime
Did you dry hop in the Primary or Secondary

Re: Pitch or not pitch Pliny Yeast Cake on American Barley W

PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2014 1:31 pm
by KTbrew
I say go for it. I recently did almost exactly the same thing with great results. I put 5 gallon of BW on the yeast of a 10 gallon batch of hoppy wheat.

Re: Pitch or not pitch Pliny Yeast Cake on American Barley W

PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2014 3:48 pm
by stusiegel
Here's what has happened so far.

Made Pliny on Saturday 10/25. Original Fermentation temp was 68F. SG was 1.068.
On Saturday Nov 1st at 11 pm FG was 1.016.
Got to taste it and it was awesome. :D
I think the yeast did it's job and sample of the beer was clean. Ok to use on the Barleywine
So I racked Pliny from my bucket to glass carboy for secondary and dry hopping.
Can't wait until it's finished with it's 2 dry hopping schedules.

The Barleywine SG was 1.126 :mrgreen:
Temperature was 68F
Before transferring the BW on to the yeast it was inoculate with lots of O2
Within 50 minutes I had active fermentation.
I did put a blow off tube on on it and 16 hrs later the lid blew off in the chest freezer. Temp in freezer is set at 64F by using a Johnson controller.

Here's a link to a picture.
https://www.amazon.com/clouddrive/share ... wDJkykBvc0

Re: Pitch or not pitch Pliny Yeast Cake on American Barley W

PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2014 7:23 pm
by MullerBrau
64 degrees seems a bit warm for a 1.125 OG barleywine. I keep mine in der BierKeller at 57 and get very nice fermenting activity. I did a 21 gallon breakfast stout on Sunday with OG=1.100 and it already worked it's way up to 68 degrees on the stick on thermometer on the fermenters.

Re: Pitch or not pitch Pliny Yeast Cake on American Barley W

PostPosted: Wed Nov 05, 2014 6:26 am
by rplace
Agree those ferment temps sound a bit high. They will always be a bit higher inside the fermentor vs. the ambient temp.

Re: Pitch or not pitch Pliny Yeast Cake on American Barley W

PostPosted: Wed Nov 05, 2014 1:56 pm
by stusiegel
If you start at a temp of say 57 in your fridge and as fermentation subsides do you raise the temp in the fridge to help keep the yeast active vs. flocculate out.

Re: Pitch or not pitch Pliny Yeast Cake on American Barley W

PostPosted: Wed Nov 05, 2014 5:34 pm
by helloworld
Please let us know how it turns out. In Brewing Classic Style JZ does not recommend repitching with yeast from a DIPA.

Re: Pitch or not pitch Pliny Yeast Cake on American Barley W

PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2014 10:02 am
by stusiegel
I read in Jamil's book it recommends not to re-pitch on a DIPA yeast cake too. So this will be a good experiment to see if it works using the Pliny Yeast Cake or not.

So far the blow off tube is working and I still hear it bubbling constantly. So the yeast is still very active at day 5 of fermentation. :P

Re: Pitch or not pitch Pliny Yeast Cake on American Barley W

PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2014 12:39 pm
by pclemon
I forget why Jamil advised against it in the book....

Conventional theory suggests not re-pitching the yeast on a batch that starts at a high gravity (however you quantify that) since a higher portion of the yeast may die or just plain be pooped out you might not get an ideal fermentation into the batch you're going to.

The question is what's considered too high of a gravity - and that's going to depend on the yeast strain you're using.

I personally would not consider 1.068 terribly high gravity provided the yeast being used is pretty tolerant of alcohol. You get up near/into the 1.08's (where I think most DIPA's are) then I would not re-use that yeast.

I am a big proponent of re-using yeast to keep costs down but typically try to schedule things out so that I can go from lower gravity to higher gravity and/or lighter color to darker color. American Ale, Pale Ale, IPA, DIPA (or Barleywine). Saison, Belgian Pale, Belgian Specialty, Tripel.

Re: Pitch or not pitch Pliny Yeast Cake on American Barley W

PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2014 1:34 pm
by helloworld
pclemon wrote:I forget why Jamil advised against it in the book....

Conventional theory suggests not re-pitching the yeast on a batch that starts at a high gravity (however you quantify that) since a higher portion of the yeast may die or just plain be pooped out you might not get an ideal fermentation into the batch you're going to.


I happen to have a copy with me at the office :D

"The high hopping level has considerable impact on yeast viability (as does the alcohol content), so it is better not to reuse this yeast"

This is found under the Imperial IPA chapter.